"Balancing Hardcore and Family Life" with Jeremy Hiebert (Comeback Kid)

[00:00:00] I'm trying to think about this while I'm speaking, but I think it was two things. From a business perspective, the whole idea is to just really saturate when you're starting. You just want to go around, come back in six months and try to build momentum while also putting out new music every two years or whatever.

[00:00:18] But then there's also, this is what we do. I was proposing, I got turned down, but I was proposing to the band, let's try to do 400 shows in one year, play double, two, three shows in a day at times. That was our sense of purpose. We're connecting, I'm getting something out of us and seeing them get something out of what we're doing, it's always been that mutually beneficial sort of relationship that we were looking for on the road. And so, yeah, we thrived off of that.

[00:00:46] Well, welcome everybody back to the... I don't know how to start shows.

[00:01:12] I don't know, but your starts are so stupid sometimes and I love it.

[00:01:15] I don't fucking know. Welcome back to The Quiet Riot Show. We're here again, it's been a little while. We have a guest with us today, which is great.

[00:01:23] I'm excited.

[00:01:24] We had a couple episodes of just you and I and I don't know, that's not as interesting.

[00:01:29] Well, we end up usually just talking about how tired we are and how busy we are.

[00:01:35] And even though like they're different stories, it's kind of becoming the same thing over and over.

[00:01:40] And so we want to change it up again, bringing back guests and we've gotten good feedbacks that people like hearing other people's perspectives.

[00:01:52] Well, I think I like hearing other people's stories.

[00:01:54] Well, and we learn a lot from you.

[00:01:56] We get wrapped up in our own worlds.

[00:01:57] And so I actually learn tons by sitting across the table from somebody and having a conversation.

[00:02:02] So it's...

[00:02:03] And today it's someone I've known for a pretty long time, like a really long time.

[00:02:09] Me too. Not personally, but...

[00:02:12] So, Jeremy, welcome.

[00:02:13] Thank you. Thank you.

[00:02:15] Jeremy is a professional musician for a living.

[00:02:18] He's...

[00:02:18] I mean, professional.

[00:02:19] Oh, come on.

[00:02:20] Let's not kid it ourselves.

[00:02:22] Entry level professional.

[00:02:23] I would say that's a fair...

[00:02:24] You play music for a living.

[00:02:26] I do.

[00:02:26] Yeah.

[00:02:26] Which is amazing.

[00:02:27] And like, you know...

[00:02:29] Most of the garage band musicians...

[00:02:32] I tried to do that.

[00:02:33] And you tried to do that.

[00:02:34] And like, you're still doing it, which is awesome.

[00:02:36] No, it's just the word professional just...

[00:02:37] That you just...

[00:02:38] It just comes with like, when I think of like a professional golfer.

[00:02:41] How about a career...

[00:02:42] A career musician?

[00:02:43] Yeah, a career musician.

[00:02:44] Okay.

[00:02:45] It means they make money.

[00:02:46] Jeez.

[00:02:47] I mean, you're still here, so there's something to that.

[00:02:50] Yeah.

[00:02:50] The mortgage payments are...

[00:02:52] Barely getting made, yeah.

[00:02:53] But they're getting made.

[00:02:54] But you know what?

[00:02:55] That's...

[00:02:56] I guess that's how we all are, but...

[00:02:59] You know, you...

[00:03:00] I assume you're doing what you love doing.

[00:03:02] Yeah.

[00:03:03] I mean, at the end of the day...

[00:03:06] I...

[00:03:07] Well, at the end of the day.

[00:03:08] At the end of the year, maybe.

[00:03:10] I look back and I'm like, man, there were so many times where I could have walked away

[00:03:15] from this.

[00:03:15] Okay.

[00:03:16] But it's, you know, it's still like something that...

[00:03:22] I don't know, that I come by honestly.

[00:03:24] Yeah.

[00:03:24] Like, I'm getting close to 50, but I still kind of like writing caveman riffs.

[00:03:29] Yeah.

[00:03:30] Like, do you feel every year like you still have unfinished business?

[00:03:33] Yep.

[00:03:34] Oh, yeah.

[00:03:34] And it's just like, okay, one more year.

[00:03:35] I'm gonna do this again.

[00:03:36] For sure.

[00:03:38] And I would also...

[00:03:39] Maybe this is my ADHD brain kicking in, but I also feel like I need to make room for that

[00:03:45] because I have other music that I want to do.

[00:03:50] And I feel like sometimes that gets pushed to the front and it's like, okay, I need to

[00:03:54] get this little project, even if it's just for me out of the way, because there is more

[00:03:57] comeback and stuff that obviously needs to be a bit more of a priority.

[00:04:02] Yeah.

[00:04:02] So sometimes these other projects that I want to do, you know, they kind of are in my periphery

[00:04:09] and they need to get out.

[00:04:10] Yeah.

[00:04:10] Okay.

[00:04:10] But to answer your question, yeah, there's still, I think, some gas in the tank as far

[00:04:16] as riff writing goes.

[00:04:17] That's good.

[00:04:17] I saw you last year?

[00:04:19] Year before?

[00:04:21] Oh, in Mexico.

[00:04:21] Last time I saw you before in Mexico.

[00:04:23] Yeah, yeah.

[00:04:23] That was so funny.

[00:04:24] It looked like there was gas in the tank.

[00:04:26] Yeah.

[00:04:26] Yeah.

[00:04:27] That was about a year and a half ago.

[00:04:28] Year and a half or so, yeah.

[00:04:29] I want to say that was March last year.

[00:04:31] But...

[00:04:31] I think you're right.

[00:04:32] Yeah.

[00:04:32] Yeah.

[00:04:32] I mean, I got to say, every comeback kid show looks like there's tons of gas left in

[00:04:37] the tank because you guys have so much energy on the stage and the fans too.

[00:04:41] And, yeah, that's just what I was going to make sure that there's an asterisk there,

[00:04:45] the fans.

[00:04:46] Yeah.

[00:04:47] We thrive off of their energy.

[00:04:49] For sure.

[00:04:50] So it's like when we're playing to like a wax museum, we might suffer a little bit,

[00:04:54] but, you know, when we can just like find that sweet spot of interaction with the crowd,

[00:04:58] then it's, yeah, it makes us look really good.

[00:05:01] Actually, that just reminds me.

[00:05:01] I saw a video where these two bands were touring together and they're really good friends.

[00:05:07] And they actually, the headlining band hired a bunch of actors for the crowd to not react

[00:05:16] at all to the music for the opening band.

[00:05:20] And like, yeah, so they literally came out and they're like, hey, are you guys ready?

[00:05:23] And they're just, people are just like chatting and not interacting at all.

[00:05:27] And I think they've done almost the whole set like that.

[00:05:30] Wow.

[00:05:30] And they came off like, what the fuck?

[00:05:32] That's mean.

[00:05:34] Fucking mean.

[00:05:34] It's funny though.

[00:05:35] I know.

[00:05:35] It's hilarious.

[00:05:36] Yeah.

[00:05:37] So before we get into all the details that we were going to be pulling out of you, we do a check in.

[00:05:45] We check in with each other.

[00:05:47] We use that with our wives now and just kind of want to know where we are at at the moment.

[00:05:54] So for us, we usually do from show to show.

[00:05:57] Um, so we'll, we'll do our check-ins first and then we'll go with you and whether you want

[00:06:01] to use, you know, last week, last month, whatever.

[00:06:04] It's a number system.

[00:06:05] One to 10.

[00:06:06] One obviously being not so good.

[00:06:15] So Tommy, how are you?

[00:06:16] Uh, I am, I'm, I'm an eight or a nine.

[00:06:19] Like fire this.

[00:06:20] I am, uh, just came off.

[00:06:23] I'm coming off a super high.

[00:06:24] So, um, we've talked about in our previous shows that, um, because we are so busy, uh,

[00:06:31] it's important for me and my wife to take some time for ourselves.

[00:06:35] And it seems like that the only way to do it is to spend shitload of money and go on a trip,

[00:06:41] you know, because we're not around the house.

[00:06:43] We're not around our responsibilities.

[00:06:45] And that way we get to actually enjoy ourselves, have a drink, sit down without like, okay, let's

[00:06:51] finish this drink and let's keep going, you know?

[00:06:53] Um, so we had a very busy weekend, but it was just like, okay, let's do this.

[00:06:57] Let's go here.

[00:06:58] Let's go there.

[00:06:58] Let's go there.

[00:06:59] And, um, it's actually perfect timing to have you on.

[00:07:03] Uh, I had a very fun musical weekend or I guess day cause we started off on Sunday.

[00:07:11] We, we were in Minneapolis.

[00:07:12] So we ended up going to, um, Paisley park to see Prince's estate.

[00:07:17] Nice.

[00:07:18] And that was unbelievable.

[00:07:19] Like, uh, you know, even my wife, who's not a, uh,

[00:07:23] musician.

[00:07:24] I mean, she played sax in high school, but I think it was saxophonia.

[00:07:27] Um, or clarinet.

[00:07:29] One of those, you know, even she like appreciated everything that was, uh, that we saw.

[00:07:35] Um, super cool.

[00:07:37] I'm not going to go into the detail because I could talk for hours, but then after that,

[00:07:42] we went to see, um, my son's favorite band day seeker.

[00:07:46] And they opened up with, uh, started with kingdom of giants and then, uh, catch your breath,

[00:07:53] which also my son loves those guys.

[00:07:56] And alpha wolf was fucking crazy.

[00:07:59] And they seeker finished the night.

[00:08:01] So great, great lineup.

[00:08:02] And I brought to brought to show the souvenirs that he got.

[00:08:07] Right.

[00:08:08] You get to live all this.

[00:08:09] Oh my God.

[00:08:10] Like three months.

[00:08:11] Yeah.

[00:08:11] You're your son now.

[00:08:12] Yeah.

[00:08:12] So you got the alpha wolf, uh, set list.

[00:08:15] Yeah.

[00:08:15] I did a tour with them.

[00:08:16] Nice.

[00:08:18] And, uh,

[00:08:18] Yeah.

[00:08:19] And then, so after they finished their set before the encore, uh, the lights went out

[00:08:25] and they pulled out the security guards in the front there.

[00:08:28] They had the flashlights.

[00:08:29] I was just shining at my son.

[00:08:30] I'm like, what the hell are they doing?

[00:08:31] And they just like hand him this paper.

[00:08:33] So there's five picks.

[00:08:35] Uh, actually six.

[00:08:37] Uh, that one was just found on the ground, but five picks were attached to it.

[00:08:40] And there's a personalized message for thanks for singing along.

[00:08:43] Cause he knows all the songs.

[00:08:45] Then they came out, they did the, um, encore and, uh, he received a stick from, uh, from

[00:08:52] the drummer Zach and Zach kind of commented on my son's photo, uh, video too, when he learned

[00:08:59] to play a song on, um, one of the secret songs.

[00:09:02] So I posted it and I mean, I tagged him and he found it super cool.

[00:09:06] So whether he recognized him or not, probably not.

[00:09:09] There's no way in hell.

[00:09:10] They see a lot of people, but you know, they recognize he was on my shoulders the whole

[00:09:14] time and singing along and everybody noticed it.

[00:09:16] So it was a really nice touch that, uh, they gave him all these things.

[00:09:20] That's awesome.

[00:09:21] It was super cool.

[00:09:21] So yeah, I'm, uh, I'm totally riding a high and, uh, it was just a great weekend with

[00:09:27] my family and, uh, kind of forgot all the responsibilities I had for job, you know, uh, not as a parent.

[00:09:36] Uh, but that was fun.

[00:09:37] Yeah.

[00:09:37] And, uh, came back, you know, then I stayed up in our six hours to work, but that's fine.

[00:09:44] That's just pay the price.

[00:09:45] It's okay.

[00:09:45] Exactly.

[00:09:46] So, uh, I'm doing great.

[00:09:47] Huh?

[00:09:47] Good.

[00:09:48] How about yourself?

[00:09:49] Oh man.

[00:09:50] Ooh.

[00:09:52] Four.

[00:09:53] Oh yeah.

[00:09:54] Yeah.

[00:09:55] Wow.

[00:09:55] Well, and we've talked about it on the show before.

[00:09:58] Uh, my wife, and I'm not going to go into detail about that, but like my wife's been

[00:10:01] pretty sick and they can't figure out what it is.

[00:10:04] And so that's a frustrating, that's an extremely frustrating situation.

[00:10:08] Yeah.

[00:10:09] And it's very taxing on every part of our life.

[00:10:11] Like it's taxing on our family life, our marriage or everything.

[00:10:15] And like, it's just struggle and you get through it and you love and you just do your best,

[00:10:20] but like it had, it hurts and it's hard.

[00:10:22] Yeah.

[00:10:22] And like, yeah, so she's, she's fatigued, like very, very fatigued, very, very frequently.

[00:10:28] So it's like she can do something for a couple hours and then she can't do anything for just

[00:10:33] an app or whatever.

[00:10:34] And so it's a big adjustment and it's just, it's gone on a lot longer than we had expected.

[00:10:39] Yeah.

[00:10:40] And so I'm just, yeah.

[00:10:41] And like with my work life and my business, it's just unbelievably busy going into that

[00:10:46] and then nevermind now this added on.

[00:10:48] And it just, it's kind of all piling on and it's, it's pretty crushing, but we're still

[00:10:55] here.

[00:10:55] We're doing it.

[00:10:56] I love that woman more than anything in the world.

[00:10:58] So it just means a little more effort when I can and a little more driving my daughter

[00:11:04] around and doing that kind of stuff, but just being a dad, being a husband.

[00:11:08] So just, I signed up for all this.

[00:11:11] So like, here we are like, there's no out.

[00:11:14] So it's just like, all right, let's do it.

[00:11:16] That's not an option.

[00:11:17] Right.

[00:11:17] So I would say I'm a four, but in some, it's such a complex thing.

[00:11:21] Cause in some ways everything's amazing.

[00:11:23] Like my life doesn't suck.

[00:11:24] Yeah.

[00:11:24] My life's great.

[00:11:25] So like, I feel like a four, but like my life is great and I'm not complaining about

[00:11:30] that.

[00:11:30] It's just, it's okay to feel a four sometimes.

[00:11:32] I feel, I feel a four and it's, it's pretty heavy, but it's okay.

[00:11:36] Yeah.

[00:11:37] We're here.

[00:11:38] Jeremy, you want to take a shift here?

[00:11:41] Oh boy.

[00:11:43] See, it's hard for me to know what baseline is.

[00:11:45] Um, it's your own baseline.

[00:11:47] Yeah.

[00:11:48] Which maybe you don't know either.

[00:11:49] Yeah.

[00:11:50] And sometimes like people take like you're a five and that's like a normal thing.

[00:11:54] Right.

[00:11:54] So for, uh, for Tim, for example, seven is like his normal.

[00:11:59] Right.

[00:12:00] Yeah.

[00:12:00] That's my baseline.

[00:12:01] Yeah.

[00:12:02] Like things, things aren't looking so peachy when it drops below seven and above that.

[00:12:05] Okay.

[00:12:06] Yeah.

[00:12:07] Um, I'd probably say I'm maybe somewhere around a six.

[00:12:12] Okay.

[00:12:13] Um, you know, kind of like Tim said, like my life doesn't suck.

[00:12:17] Yeah.

[00:12:18] I'm well aware of where I live and, um, you know, what I don't have to deal with, but

[00:12:25] at the same time, um, things could be better in a million different ways.

[00:12:32] Yeah.

[00:12:32] So some in my control, some not in my control.

[00:12:35] So yeah, probably, probably somewhere around a six.

[00:12:37] Okay.

[00:12:38] Okay.

[00:12:38] Feeling very flustered and busy at the moment.

[00:12:41] Like I was kind of saying before we came on the podcast, there's a lot, a lot going

[00:12:45] on.

[00:12:46] Yeah.

[00:12:46] And, uh, again, not all in my control, but kind of all comes across my desk if, if so

[00:12:52] to speak.

[00:12:53] Yeah.

[00:12:54] For sure.

[00:12:55] Sweet.

[00:12:55] So that means a lot of collaborative chasing down people and, uh, efforts that you're given

[00:13:03] or tasks you're given.

[00:13:05] I mean, just to, just to kind of frame that a little bit, I'm pretty independent.

[00:13:10] I'm an introvert.

[00:13:13] Um, you know, I kind of like navigating a lot of things on my own, being in a band and

[00:13:21] business with a band means that you're not going to be making calls and doing things on

[00:13:27] your own.

[00:13:28] So you're always collaborating.

[00:13:29] And as an introvert, I get that anxiety about like, Oh, how do I bring this up?

[00:13:33] Oh, this just got brought up.

[00:13:34] How do I respond?

[00:13:35] You know?

[00:13:36] Yeah.

[00:13:36] So a lot of times the Mount, the mole Hills become mountains.

[00:13:40] Yep.

[00:13:41] Yep.

[00:13:42] Which is probably part of the conversation later.

[00:13:45] Yeah.

[00:13:45] I would think we might get into that.

[00:13:47] Yeah, for sure.

[00:13:49] We'll unwrap that later.

[00:13:50] Yeah.

[00:13:50] Yeah.

[00:13:50] So, and, and also, I mean, the busy side of things, it's not necessarily a bad thing

[00:13:59] because it's a good problem to have.

[00:14:01] Yeah.

[00:14:01] Yeah.

[00:14:01] I feel, I feel that.

[00:14:03] When you're in the, when you're in the thick of it and you're like, I just, I just got back

[00:14:07] from Edmonton where we said goodbye to, um, a band that I've toured with for the last

[00:14:20] good way.

[00:14:21] It's good.

[00:14:22] And the weight is okay.

[00:14:23] And then the, the sixes and the fives and fours like they're okay.

[00:14:27] Oh yeah.

[00:14:28] It's just, they are what they are and you have to feel them.

[00:14:30] Oh yeah.

[00:14:30] And you just have to have that experience and like, it's okay.

[00:14:34] And I, we talk a lot about this on the show and it's like, you're allowed, even if your

[00:14:38] life's great, you're allowed to feel like shit.

[00:14:40] Oh yeah.

[00:14:40] You're allowed to feel overwhelmed.

[00:14:42] You're allowed to feel sad or depressed or anxious or whatever that is.

[00:14:46] Like those are, those are important feelings to feel when you have them.

[00:14:49] Oh totally.

[00:14:49] And a lot of what is making me feel like a five or six stressed out is because I'm trying

[00:14:54] to not just myself, but other people involved, get us to a place where we're feeling a seven

[00:15:00] or eight about it.

[00:15:01] Exactly.

[00:15:02] Right.

[00:15:02] Yeah.

[00:15:03] So getting, getting to that point, you know, is, is that's, that's, that's the grind.

[00:15:08] Yeah.

[00:15:08] Yeah.

[00:15:09] But you know, I wanted to say like that all those fours and fives, like they, if we didn't

[00:15:16] have those in life, we would never evolve.

[00:15:18] We would never get better at things.

[00:15:19] Right.

[00:15:20] Cause something bad.

[00:15:21] I truly believe that if there's something that happens to you and it's negative, it's

[00:15:27] there, it's there for a reason, you know, for us to get better or improve on things.

[00:15:30] So I've always felt like growth comes, growth comes when things are tough.

[00:15:38] Yeah.

[00:15:39] Cause that's your opportunity to rise to a challenge to grow and all that stuff.

[00:15:42] And so, yeah, things have to get tough or else you just don't know what that feels like.

[00:15:47] Exactly.

[00:15:48] The seven for me feels so much better because I know what a three feels.

[00:15:51] Yeah, exactly.

[00:15:53] Right.

[00:15:53] And I feel weird around people that are nines all the time because there are, there's

[00:15:59] people that fake it, but then I also think that there are people that are up there all

[00:16:02] the time and I feel kind of weird being around them cause I just can't relate.

[00:16:06] Yeah.

[00:16:06] I don't know what to do with people like that.

[00:16:08] Yeah.

[00:16:08] I'm like, I'm so happy for them.

[00:16:11] There's a certain level of your happiness and over joyousness is just dressing.

[00:16:16] My God, I can just picture you like, why the fuck are you so happy?

[00:16:21] But it must be nice.

[00:16:22] I don't know.

[00:16:23] Yeah.

[00:16:23] I don't know, but I'm assuming it's great.

[00:16:25] The cynical part of me wants to emphasize that we need those threes and fours.

[00:16:30] Yeah.

[00:16:31] Yeah.

[00:16:31] But there are also people that can just fly on nine.

[00:16:34] Maybe enter the wooden box in a nine.

[00:16:36] I'm not one of them.

[00:16:37] I don't understand.

[00:16:37] Yeah.

[00:16:38] I actually have friends like that and you know, my kids, like I let them like kind

[00:16:45] of play in dirt and stuff like once in a while.

[00:16:47] But like essentially when I see a kid rolling in mud and just the parents like, ah, that's

[00:16:52] funny.

[00:16:53] I was losing my shit.

[00:16:54] I was like, oh my God.

[00:16:56] Like how can you let your kid do that?

[00:16:57] But they're just, ah, that's fine.

[00:16:59] That's being a nine.

[00:16:59] Yeah, exactly.

[00:17:00] Same thing.

[00:17:01] Yeah.

[00:17:01] I don't get it, but hey, good for you.

[00:17:05] So let's dig into it.

[00:17:06] So, okay.

[00:17:08] So we talked, you already mentioned your, you're in Comeback Kid.

[00:17:12] A fairly, I would say a fairly well-known band in all over the world.

[00:17:16] Really.

[00:17:17] You've traveled like crazy.

[00:17:18] Um, I guess some of the things, what am I going to ask then?

[00:17:23] There's so much here.

[00:17:25] Um, I've known you forever through different bands and from repressed and like way back.

[00:17:31] We're not even going to go that far back.

[00:17:32] We don't have to, but, but music has been a journey of yours for a very, very long time.

[00:17:37] I think is probably the right way to say it.

[00:17:39] Um, how has that been for you?

[00:17:43] Let's take maybe like, give me a snapshot of 20 years ago and a snapshot of 10 and then

[00:17:50] five.

[00:17:51] What about 30 years?

[00:17:52] No, sure.

[00:17:53] Yeah.

[00:17:53] We can go as far back as you want.

[00:17:55] You decide.

[00:17:56] Um, like at what point did you sort of, did something click with you where you're like,

[00:18:00] Oh, I'm going to do this.

[00:18:01] I want to do this.

[00:18:04] Oh, um, I think that.

[00:18:07] But in my teenage years, that was always something that I didn't think I was going to do, but

[00:18:15] I wanted to do like, like if I could do that, that'd be sick.

[00:18:19] Um, but just like I grew up rurally, I moved around a ton.

[00:18:24] Um, I just never had a point of reference, like, you know, with getting into a band or

[00:18:29] any of that stuff until I moved to Winnipeg when I was 18.

[00:18:33] So yeah, it was, I don't think I necessarily want to call it a fantasy, but I, you know,

[00:18:38] I learned how to play guitar on my own.

[00:18:40] I, I grew up in a very strict religious home that did not allow the kind of music that I

[00:18:47] wanted to live.

[00:18:47] You and me both, buddy.

[00:18:48] Yeah.

[00:18:48] Was that the devil's music?

[00:18:50] Yeah.

[00:18:51] Yeah.

[00:18:51] So I, I had to, I, and I was pretty, you know, from their perspective, I'd have to

[00:18:56] say I was pretty good about it, but I also found my way around it.

[00:19:00] Um, but I, I just, yeah, writing was always something that, you know, just coming up with

[00:19:05] song ideas, not necessarily lyrics so much, but like, you know, building songs.

[00:19:09] Um, that was always something, especially once I would say I hit around 16, like ever since

[00:19:15] then I've, yeah, that's, that's, that's just sort of like a life purpose.

[00:19:20] Um, and then, yeah, I moved to Winnipeg when I was 18 and yeah, came here with zero like

[00:19:28] connections, but just kind of found, you know, my way around and not to spend too much

[00:19:34] time in the early years, but you know, if for people that are familiar with Winnipeg

[00:19:40] venues, like, you know, started hanging out around the Albert and that's kind of where

[00:19:43] things started to really click as far as like meeting the right people to get me to where

[00:19:49] I am now or, you know?

[00:19:51] Yeah.

[00:19:51] Well, and there was a scene like there was, there was a scene of people and if you hadn't

[00:19:55] very interesting scene, if you, yeah.

[00:19:56] Oh yeah.

[00:19:57] Now that I've done a lot of touring looking back at the, at the mid nineties from my

[00:20:01] perspective, weird, like really weird, like very PC and there was like very Christian and

[00:20:08] there, there, there, there was other stuff too, but like those kinds of things were like,

[00:20:13] like very, very, um, front and center in Winnipeg music in the mid nineties.

[00:20:20] But we were all in the room together.

[00:20:21] Yeah.

[00:20:22] Yeah.

[00:20:22] So often we were all, we were very much so in the room together for the most part.

[00:20:26] There was some friction for sure, but, but for the most part, and that's, that's what drew

[00:20:30] me, I think in a, in a, in a large part to, you know, sort of the sub genre of hardcore.

[00:20:36] It was like, I could be like, I'm not that person.

[00:20:39] Cause I was also a Christian back then, which I'm, you know, I've, I've dipped out, but

[00:20:43] I was too.

[00:20:44] But at the time I really appreciated the fact that a Christian, a Muslim, a straight edge

[00:20:51] kid, an atheist, a vegan, whoever could all be at the same show.

[00:20:58] Members of all of those mindsets were in member were members of all of those bands on

[00:21:03] the same bill and it was fine.

[00:21:04] There'd be discussions, but it was just like, I'm learning from you.

[00:21:08] You're learning from me.

[00:21:08] We're not always going to agree on everything, but I really liked that.

[00:21:11] That was so eyeopening for me when I started participating in that scene.

[00:21:16] Yeah.

[00:21:16] And like, cause I, I grew up similar.

[00:21:18] I grew up in a pretty, I grew up in Winnipeg, but like a fairly strict, like nineties Christian

[00:21:23] home.

[00:21:24] And I think everyone knows anyone who's been there knows the nineties were a little different

[00:21:28] for Christian homes than they are today.

[00:21:30] Yeah.

[00:21:31] And once I got exposed to some of that, like I was going to shows and I was, there was

[00:21:37] bands and there was like, yeah, there was like the Christian people that I, we played some

[00:21:42] Christian shows together, but they weren't like Christian shows, but we were a group.

[00:21:46] And then there was still this other group and like, we were all together.

[00:21:49] Yeah.

[00:21:49] And it rarely, not very often do I remember experiencing too much friction around that.

[00:21:56] No, there was some, but like.

[00:21:57] It was for the most part, it was really friendly and it was really community.

[00:22:01] Like it was, it was very much a community.

[00:22:04] Well, I think that that still happens though.

[00:22:06] Like where that the, the fan base or the musicians kind of have these communities.

[00:22:13] I think there's just more, uh, subsections, I guess, of people.

[00:22:19] Yeah, I think so.

[00:22:19] Cause like, I, I've always find like, um, I've been to a couple, I don't want to really,

[00:22:26] uh, admit to it, but a couple of pop artists, you know, concerts.

[00:22:31] I'll admit to that shit all day long.

[00:22:32] I got free tickets.

[00:22:34] I went anyways, but no, like, you know, I've seen more aggression, uh, at those shows than

[00:22:40] like at, um, at like metal shows or, or hardcore shows because like people, like you really,

[00:22:46] people get together at these shows and everyone's friends.

[00:22:49] And like, I just, I love that, that music community that, um, kind of.

[00:22:54] Now you've, you've been all over doing this for a very long time.

[00:22:58] How do you like, you see other music scenes.

[00:23:02] There's a lot of cities you've been to enough times that you like see familiar faces.

[00:23:06] You see familiar people, you see that community.

[00:23:08] How would you separate Winnipeg from that or how, or is it the same?

[00:23:12] Um, yeah, I mean, there's definitely comparisons you can make, but I, I don't, I think Winnipeg,

[00:23:19] especially back then would have been fairly unique just because of like the demographics.

[00:23:24] So I was kind of describing like there was a really, it, maybe I have things completely

[00:23:29] wrong, but in my perception, there was a big PC scene and there was a big Christian scene.

[00:23:34] Yeah.

[00:23:35] Like, like big per capita, like, like Winnipeg's not a big city, but there was a big, like you,

[00:23:40] you put on a local show that we had like three, four or 500 kids that would come out like to

[00:23:45] arguably no name bands that, that people across the country never heard of any of these,

[00:23:49] but there'd be a ton of kids out and you know, just to segue a little bit and then I'll come back.

[00:23:55] But I feel like that ended up being a bit of a launch pad for like my musical career, because I did,

[00:24:01] I did come out of that scene and like figure four comeback kid, even though comeback kid, just to clear it up,

[00:24:08] we've done this a million times, has never been a Christian band. No figure four. Yes, it was,

[00:24:12] but none of us are there either. Anyways, you know, we kind of came from that and that was,

[00:24:19] that, that was hugely beneficial to getting both of those bands going.

[00:24:22] It was birthed out of that for sure. Absolutely. Yeah. So going back to like comparing, um,

[00:24:28] you know, I think that because of our geography, it kind of kept that uniqueness about it. You know,

[00:24:33] we kind of like, like when I talk to my friends who live out East, like in Connecticut, New York,

[00:24:40] Massachusetts, I'm like, you guys are so lucky. Like you could hold jobs and do these weekend tours

[00:24:48] and then come home, work your job and then go drive two hours, two hours, two hours, come home,

[00:24:54] work your job. And you could do that for half a year and you're always playing a different city.

[00:25:00] Yeah. We never had that luxury. We got to go far. Like when I city bigger than us is Minneapolis.

[00:25:06] That's a border and about a seven hour drive. Yeah. For me, when I was doing it, it was Toronto.

[00:25:11] You go to Toronto and then you do everything from there and that's like your home base.

[00:25:15] And then it's like, okay, we got two hours. We got two, we got three, we got like, that was what it was.

[00:25:20] And so it's like, Oh, you start with the 24 hour drive, which also like, I know you, I know your history

[00:25:26] a little better, but like you did those drives. Yes, you are. Are you still the driver?

[00:25:31] I just drove to Edmonton and back by myself. Okay. You've done a million miles by yourself.

[00:25:37] Easily. Yeah. Oh, probably more than a million. Probably. Yeah. Oh yeah. I would think.

[00:25:41] Is that just preference? Like you just love driving. It's a bit of both. It's like, I'm the most comfortable

[00:25:48] behind the wheel and I think everybody is also the most comfortable with me being behind the wheel.

[00:25:54] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it just kind of works out that way. And I'm also, I guess the introvert

[00:25:57] part would like some peace, some quiet, like just the drive by yourself is probably actually a,

[00:26:02] you might look forward to that. Yeah. Yeah. Especially like compress a bit.

[00:26:07] Now I have my phone and yeah, I can flip through the news and whatever, but especially like, let's say

[00:26:12] like 10, 15 years ago, everybody was just on their laptops watching shows. Right. Yeah. Downloaded

[00:26:17] like lost or whatever. Yeah. I don't watch TV. So for me, I'd much prefer to drive and you know, do nothing.

[00:26:26] Yeah. That's fair. Be peaceful. Yeah. Quiet. And like there were times where I would do a 24 hour drive

[00:26:31] just by myself to get from point A to point B because there was limited time. So I'd be, I'll just do it myself.

[00:26:37] Yeah. Yeah. That's great. It's faster doing it by myself than three people taking turns. True.

[00:26:43] Yeah, for sure. You just hammer, you get into the groove and then you just go. Yeah. I'm very stubborn

[00:26:48] sometimes. So when you started touring, like when you started touring a lot, so let's say, I guess

[00:26:55] probably figure four days would have been when touring really started to happen for you. What was that

[00:27:00] experience like? Well, I, so, so just, just for people that aren't fully familiar, like I joined figure four

[00:27:10] in 2000 and yeah, I think, well, I don't think, yeah, I was kind of around for the writing of the

[00:27:16] second record, but writing and recording, but yeah, after that second record came out, then, you know,

[00:27:22] started doing a lot of touring and then the third record, then it was even busier. Um, but yeah, it

[00:27:30] was, I mean, that was my gateway to see the world. Like, I mean, we did some weird things looking back.

[00:27:37] Like one of the, one of the weird ones was we got offered to go to some would say South America, but it

[00:27:44] actually ended up being Brazil. So we did a 13 day tour in Brazil in 25 days, which nobody's ever done

[00:27:51] to my knowledge. It's, it's, it's, unless you're from there, it's very different. If you're a Brazilian

[00:27:56] band, you would do that. But yeah, we played some interesting places, but yeah, like all of that was

[00:28:03] formative. Like we didn't know, we didn't know, like now, now, now I can help bands like take that

[00:28:09] deal, just do it this way or whatever. We didn't have anybody to lean on.

[00:28:13] You're just like, here's somebody who wants to bring you down and they'll buy your tickets

[00:28:19] and details like looking at like, yeah, it's just, well, and that was like early internet.

[00:28:24] So it wasn't like what it is today. Oh yeah. And so like, there was no, there's no forum to help

[00:28:29] you figure this out. There's nobody by your side. There's no, no. And like at that point,

[00:28:35] probably no manager, no, like maybe a friend as a tour manager to help out or whatever, but

[00:28:39] like just all your songs. We're getting on a plane and I guess just us.

[00:28:43] But was that like an opportunity for like, did you guys look at it as an opportunity?

[00:28:48] It was like, Hey, this is pretty cool.

[00:28:49] Oh, absolutely.

[00:28:50] And now, now you're like looking back, it's like, Oh, that, that was dumb.

[00:28:53] I mean, it was, it was so dumb, but also like, I'm so glad we had that experience because

[00:28:59] you know, like when, like at the time there were moments where it was like, like, what

[00:29:04] are we doing? There's some beefing in the band, beefing with like just the way things were

[00:29:09] happening or not happening, like language barriers. That was our first actual, like, you know,

[00:29:15] we had a translator on the tour who was friends with the band that brought us down that wanted

[00:29:22] to tour with us is the way I understood it. Maybe I'm wrong. But anyways, he ended up leaving

[00:29:27] the tour because apparently there was some money issues that were affecting us that we

[00:29:33] weren't aware of. And he got in a big fight with them and left the tour. And then we're

[00:29:37] like, Oh cool. We just found out that things are going sideways. And now the translators

[00:29:41] and now nobody understands us and we don't understand him. So at the time it seemed insane.

[00:29:48] Like, but also now looking back, like, what was that? 22 years ago? It was like, wow.

[00:29:54] Like that, that's pretty cool that we got to experience that, but I'd never want to do

[00:29:58] that again. But wow. Yeah, that was cool.

[00:30:01] And have you been back there since?

[00:30:02] Oh, many, yeah. Oh, not many times.

[00:30:03] You guys have been back there.

[00:30:05] Yeah. Like that, that was before Comeback had had ever gone, but I think Comeback had

[00:30:09] done South America five times now.

[00:30:10] Okay.

[00:30:11] Yeah.

[00:30:11] Yeah. We've, we've actually run into a few of the people that, you know, we met, you

[00:30:16] know, way back then. So that's always cool.

[00:30:18] Yeah.

[00:30:19] Yeah. That's interesting to see the progression and like where, Oh yeah. Like it's doing that

[00:30:24] kind of crazy shit. And then now it's a little more organized.

[00:30:27] The way we do it now is completely different.

[00:30:29] Yeah.

[00:30:29] We're going to play, well, we actually did more shows in Brazil than we ever have before

[00:30:35] with Comeback had, I think we did five, but usually you do like two or three, you'll play

[00:30:39] one in Argentina, Peru, Chile.

[00:30:41] Okay. Yeah.

[00:30:41] You know, you'll hit up all the countries.

[00:30:43] You'll do like maybe 10, 12 shows max, but that's from Columbia. So like not just one

[00:30:49] country.

[00:30:49] Yeah.

[00:30:49] You guys two were like hard.

[00:30:53] Yeah.

[00:30:53] Like you guys, I would say we, we, maybe not as much so, but like you guys did a lot of

[00:30:59] time on the road.

[00:31:00] Yes.

[00:31:00] Yeah.

[00:31:01] That's not, I don't think that's normal.

[00:31:05] Yeah.

[00:31:05] Sorry.

[00:31:06] Maybe not normal is not the right word, but like that's not the usual.

[00:31:11] I think for us, it was like that first decade.

[00:31:15] Yeah.

[00:31:15] It was just like, we basically said yes to everything.

[00:31:19] If we had, you know, the, the, the window was open.

[00:31:22] We didn't have something else booked.

[00:31:24] Um, but yeah, our whole thing was just like, we just wanted to hammer it.

[00:31:28] And was it just like, here's our window of opportunity.

[00:31:31] We have this thing going and we want, this is like to say yes as often as possible.

[00:31:36] Just we'll keep this thing moving forward or what was the thought process for you?

[00:31:40] Like for you personally behind, okay, I'm going to do, okay, we're going in here.

[00:31:44] Okay.

[00:31:44] We're going in here.

[00:31:45] Like we're just going to put tons and tons of travel miles on.

[00:31:48] I think it was, it was, it was, I'm trying to think about this while I'm, while I'm speaking,

[00:31:55] but I think it was two things like from, from a business perspective, the whole idea

[00:32:00] is to just like, you know, really saturate when you're starting.

[00:32:05] So yeah, you just want to go around, come back in six months and try to build, you're

[00:32:09] building, you're building, you're trying to build momentum while also putting out

[00:32:12] new music like every two years or whatever.

[00:32:14] But then there's also, you know, this is what we do.

[00:32:18] This is like, I mean, I, I was proposing, I got turned down, but I was proposing to

[00:32:21] the band, like let's try to do 400 shows in one year.

[00:32:24] Like, you know, play, play double some that, you know, two, three, two, three, two, three

[00:32:29] shows, like in a day, some at times, you know, it like, it was, I wouldn't say it was always

[00:32:35] fun, but it, but it was just like, you know, that, that was our sense of purpose.

[00:32:40] Like, like, you know, we're, we're connecting, like I'm getting something out of this and seeing

[00:32:44] them get something out of what we're doing.

[00:32:46] Like, you know, it's, it's a mute, it's always been that mutually beneficial sort of relationship

[00:32:51] that we were looking for on the road.

[00:32:53] And so, yeah, we, we thrived off of that.

[00:32:56] And then, yeah, we're still quite active, but, but now, you know, we're just not going

[00:33:02] to hit the markets like we used to, because it'd be like, oh, I just thought come back

[00:33:07] at three months ago.

[00:33:08] So why would I, why would I go?

[00:33:09] Have the crowds, have people changed?

[00:33:11] Have the crowds changed in a sense that you've had to adapt to that?

[00:33:16] Or the fan base or the, I don't know what you, I don't know how, how far you want me

[00:33:20] to drill down, but, but, but it really, whatever you want to talk about, it varies by region.

[00:33:24] Yeah.

[00:33:25] Okay.

[00:33:25] Like to be honest.

[00:33:26] So like, if I'm to go to where we have the most turnover, it'd be America, you know, like

[00:33:32] that's me.

[00:33:34] You know what though?

[00:33:35] It's interesting.

[00:33:36] There's a bit of a revival happening, you know, the old stuff.

[00:33:40] Um, we're seeing older folks come out more than we, then like when we started, we were,

[00:33:48] we were at the top, like, like people, you know, they, they were going to be seen at a

[00:33:54] comeback in show.

[00:33:57] Then like we started touring full time, I'd say 2003 with comeback in then closer to the

[00:34:02] end of that decade.

[00:34:03] Like, you know, let's say 08, uh, maybe into the past 10 or whatever.

[00:34:10] It, it, it just didn't, it didn't connect in the same way in America.

[00:34:14] Like we still, we'd still go down with our shows to be fine, but we weren't like, you

[00:34:19] know, so bands, bands in America, they shoot to the top and then you have to be ready for

[00:34:24] the drop.

[00:34:24] Like, just, that's just the way it happened.

[00:34:25] What did that feel like going through that?

[00:34:27] Um, like when you actually realized like something shifting, you know what, if we put

[00:34:33] all of our eggs in that basket, it would have sucked.

[00:34:37] But thankfully we also like, we, we, we came out swinging in America like hard, like those

[00:34:44] first two records really hard.

[00:34:45] But towards like, after we put out wake the dead in 2005, we started to also hit Europe

[00:34:53] pretty regularly.

[00:34:54] And so as that was kind of like, as, as the honeymoon was kind of, you know, we're, we're

[00:35:00] coming out of that in America, Europe was picking up only like, and, and honestly, like that,

[00:35:09] that, that's, that's our oldest crowd.

[00:35:11] People that came out 20 years ago are still coming out.

[00:35:14] And so we have like the widest range of fans in Europe because there's a lot more just,

[00:35:20] you know, they stay with their bands, you know, more and Canada would be somewhere in

[00:35:23] the middle as would, you know, places like Australia, South America is a bit of an older

[00:35:28] crowd too.

[00:35:29] Okay.

[00:35:29] But yeah, it varies.

[00:35:31] I do sense that there is a bit of a, like in our generations, genres of whatever you want

[00:35:39] to call it, hardcore alternative music, whatever.

[00:35:43] There is like definitely a resurgence happening right now and has been for maybe a year or

[00:35:49] two.

[00:35:49] I've been feeling it and sensing it coming and like even talking to my daughter, my daughter's

[00:35:54] 13 and like, I play music for her and she's like, and this isn't.

[00:35:59] You, but like, she's like, oh, this is emo.

[00:36:02] Yeah.

[00:36:02] And I'm like, kind of.

[00:36:04] Yeah.

[00:36:04] But like, but she likes it and she's just like, oh yeah, this is, I know this song or

[00:36:09] I heard this song and it's like, you fucking did?

[00:36:12] Yeah.

[00:36:12] Like what?

[00:36:12] And I, I think that's shifted in the last couple of years.

[00:36:16] You're seeing all these tours coming back.

[00:36:18] I mean, you're seeing now warp tours doing a small stint or three or four dates and next

[00:36:24] year.

[00:36:24] Like there is a resurgence and it must be mainly fueled by our generation going to these things

[00:36:32] and wanting these things.

[00:36:34] Yeah.

[00:36:34] I, I don't know.

[00:36:35] Some people have said it's, it's, you know, like they're, you know, when we were young festival

[00:36:39] stuff like that, like you went to shows back in the early two thousands, then you had your

[00:36:45] family and now, you know, you might not be empty nesters just yet, but you can leave.

[00:36:50] But the kids can make it stay home.

[00:36:53] Exactly.

[00:36:53] Bring your kids.

[00:36:54] Yeah.

[00:36:54] Well, I take my daughter to stuff.

[00:36:56] Like the amount of photos I've taken with a dad and his daughter or son or whatever.

[00:37:00] That's cool.

[00:37:00] That's kind of fun.

[00:37:00] Like that number's going up.

[00:37:01] Yeah.

[00:37:02] Yeah.

[00:37:02] For sure.

[00:37:02] So yeah, that, that's.

[00:37:04] Well, and you guys have done it too.

[00:37:06] Like you, you're, you're a dad, you're a, you're a husband.

[00:37:08] Like you have your.

[00:37:10] I brought my kids to Furnace Fest, you know?

[00:37:12] Yeah.

[00:37:12] Like you've done, you're doing the thing.

[00:37:14] How's the, what's that been like?

[00:37:16] Uh, yeah, it's, it's, it's cool.

[00:37:18] Cause I have always made it a bit of a, how do I word this?

[00:37:24] Like I never wanted to like push my interests or just because this is what I do.

[00:37:31] You should like it too.

[00:37:31] Sure.

[00:37:32] Like I don't, I don't want my kid to be a hardcore kid if they don't want to be a hardcore kid.

[00:37:36] Yeah.

[00:37:36] Yeah.

[00:37:36] Exactly.

[00:37:37] If they have a genuine interest, I will take you to whatever show you want.

[00:37:39] For sure.

[00:37:40] But I'm not good.

[00:37:41] Like if I sense that, you know, like you want to leave, like I took my kid to a few

[00:37:45] shows and he has a genuine interest in it.

[00:37:48] But you know, when he's ready to go, let's go.

[00:37:51] Cause I, I don't want to burn that.

[00:37:52] There's no reason to burn that up.

[00:37:54] Yeah.

[00:37:55] So, and my daughter, she's five.

[00:37:56] So I don't know, you know, where, where, where that'll be.

[00:37:59] She hasn't settled into anything yet by any means.

[00:38:00] But yeah, no, for sure.

[00:38:01] But I took, I took my son to on tour in Europe this summer and it was like, yeah, about two

[00:38:08] and a half weeks.

[00:38:09] And that, that was, that's awesome.

[00:38:12] Like the further that goes away on the calendar, the more I'm just like, wow, I got away with

[00:38:17] that.

[00:38:17] Like somehow everything, like I had some anxiety a month leading up to that one.

[00:38:22] Cause like, you know, there's certain things that could have gone wrong that would have

[00:38:25] thrown the tour off, you know, cause I gotta, in that situation, I gotta be dad first.

[00:38:30] Um, but everything went smoothly and I was like, wow.

[00:38:33] That's amazing.

[00:38:34] Well, and what an experience for him, like just to see the world, like nevermind the music

[00:38:38] side of it, take that out.

[00:38:39] But like for him at that age to be able to see the world, like that's, I didn't get to

[00:38:44] do that.

[00:38:45] Like, no, you know where my dad took me in the construction to help him shovel the rock

[00:38:50] and everything.

[00:38:50] You got to go to Hungary or whatever, which was just down the street.

[00:38:53] But, um, yeah, no, by the way, I'm, I was so pissed.

[00:38:57] I missed you guys twice in my home country.

[00:39:00] Hungary?

[00:39:01] No, Slovakia.

[00:39:02] Oh, Slovakia.

[00:39:02] By like, one was by like two or three days.

[00:39:05] What's the big city in Slovakia?

[00:39:07] Uh, there was Bratislava.

[00:39:08] Oh, we just played there.

[00:39:09] Yeah.

[00:39:09] And you guys played in Košice as well, I think.

[00:39:12] When would that have been?

[00:39:13] That sounds familiar.

[00:39:14] A while, a while ago.

[00:39:15] Um, everything kind of blurs together.

[00:39:16] Yeah.

[00:39:17] But yeah, my son's been to Bratislava.

[00:39:19] Yeah.

[00:39:19] So we play it on a boat.

[00:39:20] Randall?

[00:39:21] Was it on a boat?

[00:39:22] Oh, on the boat?

[00:39:23] Okay.

[00:39:23] It was like a, sort of a punk barge.

[00:39:25] Oh, okay.

[00:39:25] Like when I say boat, don't think like fancy.

[00:39:28] Yeah, yeah.

[00:39:28] Like it's like a barge tied to the.

[00:39:30] I saw you in Mexico.

[00:39:31] I know what you guys are like.

[00:39:33] You guys are willing to play.

[00:39:34] We'll do whatever.

[00:39:35] Like.

[00:39:35] Well, but that's cool.

[00:39:36] Like, that's great.

[00:39:38] And like, I remember we talked about it in Mexico a bit and I was talking to Andrew about

[00:39:41] it a bit too at the, that night.

[00:39:43] And it was just like, I don't know.

[00:39:44] We had dates to fill.

[00:39:45] We figured let's drive somewhere and go play.

[00:39:47] I mean, in that situation.

[00:39:48] We didn't know what was going to happen.

[00:39:50] We didn't, we had never played Merida before.

[00:39:53] And so it was like, like our friend Bailey, who was, you know, living in Mexico at the

[00:39:58] time.

[00:39:59] He's like, dude, I can, you know, hook this up and whatever the money's not going to be

[00:40:03] great, but it was just like, let's do it.

[00:40:06] Yeah.

[00:40:06] You know, like we're playing over here and we got to get there.

[00:40:09] And this is right here.

[00:40:10] This is in between.

[00:40:10] So let's do it.

[00:40:11] And I had been there as a kid.

[00:40:13] Oh, okay.

[00:40:14] Cause I used to live in Belize.

[00:40:15] Like not, not too far from there.

[00:40:17] So that was the place where the community that we were living in, that's where they would

[00:40:21] go get their teeth fixed.

[00:40:23] So I had a memory of being there when I was probably 11 or 12.

[00:40:28] Okay.

[00:40:28] Okay.

[00:40:28] Nice.

[00:40:29] So I kind of really wanted to go.

[00:40:31] Yeah.

[00:40:31] I remember you video chatted me for a song or two.

[00:40:34] Yeah.

[00:40:34] I think I did.

[00:40:34] It was fun.

[00:40:36] That show was definitely the most different out of all of them.

[00:40:39] It was just like, you know, parking lot.

[00:40:41] Like, yeah.

[00:40:41] I saw the pile of garbage there too.

[00:40:43] It was like a half kind of biker.

[00:40:46] I think it was a biker bar a little bit, like not that night.

[00:40:50] And like, it was, yeah.

[00:40:51] Like it was like a parking lot.

[00:40:53] There was a stage.

[00:40:55] It was like a run down to MC.

[00:40:58] It was awesome.

[00:40:58] Like it was great.

[00:40:59] I thought it was good.

[00:41:00] The crowd seemed good.

[00:41:02] Oh yeah.

[00:41:02] Like, I mean, that's the thing.

[00:41:03] Like, you know, you can sense that appreciation that it's like, you're coming to our town.

[00:41:07] Nobody does.

[00:41:08] Yeah.

[00:41:08] So, you know, that alone makes it worth it because those happy faces, you'll see happy

[00:41:14] faces at other shows, but they're genuinely stoked because, you know, this doesn't happen

[00:41:18] every day.

[00:41:18] So.

[00:41:19] Is that still a big driver for you?

[00:41:21] Is just the reward of the people and the fans and the crowd?

[00:41:25] Like that's still.

[00:41:25] Maybe, maybe it sounds egotistical, but.

[00:41:27] No.

[00:41:28] But it's nice.

[00:41:28] There's nothing egotistical about that.

[00:41:30] Like, I'm from Winnipeg, Manitoba now, but also a rural kid.

[00:41:35] And so anytime something would happen, again, it's not like the East Coast, like in the States

[00:41:41] or even like in Canada, you know, bands will always come up and hit Montreal, Toronto and

[00:41:45] then.

[00:41:45] Yeah.

[00:41:46] Do do do do do.

[00:41:46] Yeah.

[00:41:46] And then Vancouver.

[00:41:47] Yeah.

[00:41:48] Yeah.

[00:41:48] So I know what that feels like, you know, when, when, like for me growing up, one of my

[00:41:55] favorite bands was Tourniquet.

[00:41:57] They're like a Christian thrash band.

[00:41:57] Oh, I remember them.

[00:41:58] And they played the West End Cultural Center in 1994.

[00:42:01] Yep.

[00:42:02] I had to be there.

[00:42:03] I was at that show.

[00:42:04] That was, yeah, it had to happen, you know, because this band is coming.

[00:42:08] So, yeah, I don't, I can't remember what kind of maneuvers I had to do with my parents,

[00:42:13] but I remember I drove down here with a friend and yeah, went to the show.

[00:42:17] But, but I, as a fan was so appreciative of that.

[00:42:21] Oh, absolutely.

[00:42:22] That for me, it's like when there are opportunities to, you know, play places off the beaten path

[00:42:27] that aren't gonna, you know, we're not gonna lose our shirt doing it.

[00:42:30] Yeah.

[00:42:30] But, you know, why not?

[00:42:32] Well, and like, you know, before my son got into the same type of music that, you know,

[00:42:40] I maybe helped nudged him a little bit that way, but at the end of it, like you said,

[00:42:44] I'm not gonna push him.

[00:42:45] Yeah.

[00:42:45] I tried it with my daughter and, oh, she's a Swifty, you know, that's okay.

[00:42:48] And that's fair, you know.

[00:42:48] Totally.

[00:42:49] Lost one soldier, that's okay.

[00:42:52] But, you know, so now he's into it.

[00:42:53] And like before I was like always, well, Minneapolis is not that far, but I'm not gonna go by myself

[00:42:59] because my wife's not really into that music.

[00:43:01] So unless some friends went, you know, we wouldn't go.

[00:43:04] And, but now it's like, hey, Jacob, check it out.

[00:43:07] This band's playing, you know, it's only a seven hour drive, you know, it's not that bad.

[00:43:11] And like we went to Sioux Falls for a show now in Minneapolis.

[00:43:15] And, you know, I'm just now keeping an eye always because, yeah, they don't tend to come to Winnipeg.

[00:43:19] Yeah.

[00:43:19] Yeah.

[00:43:20] But they might just get close enough for us to take a road trip.

[00:43:23] Well, in Minneapolis, like the three of us grew up in Winnipeg to an extent.

[00:43:27] And like Minneapolis is where you go.

[00:43:30] Like you want to go see shows, you go to Minneapolis.

[00:43:33] Oh, that's the closest.

[00:43:34] I have done that drive.

[00:43:34] I think all three of us could do that drive almost blindfolded.

[00:43:37] Yeah.

[00:43:38] You probably for sure.

[00:43:39] Grand Forks exit 138.

[00:43:41] That's where I go to Qdoba and Starbucks.

[00:43:45] And then I carry on and I get off, I think, at exit 60 to get on 995.

[00:43:48] You can definitely do it with crazy eyes.

[00:43:50] See, I'm in Alexandria.

[00:43:52] That's where I stop for gas.

[00:43:53] What are you going to do when your tour van can drive itself?

[00:43:56] Yeah, right.

[00:43:56] Right.

[00:43:58] I'm more of a backseat driver.

[00:44:00] Like I love napping during rides.

[00:44:01] Oh, yeah.

[00:44:02] You don't like driving?

[00:44:02] No.

[00:44:03] I mean, I like driving at night.

[00:44:05] Okay.

[00:44:05] That's no problem for me.

[00:44:07] But yeah, afternoon is like, I like napping.

[00:44:11] Yeah.

[00:44:11] Fair enough.

[00:44:12] Well, you work nights too, though.

[00:44:13] I used to, yeah.

[00:44:14] You're like a, you're a night owl.

[00:44:16] My schedule is all over the place.

[00:44:18] Afternal animal.

[00:44:19] Yeah.

[00:44:19] Yeah.

[00:44:19] I function better at night for sure.

[00:44:21] Yeah.

[00:44:22] So you.

[00:44:23] But yeah, let's get into, I really want to talk about, you know, being in a touring band

[00:44:30] and starting a family.

[00:44:32] It's going to be tough.

[00:44:33] Like, I mean, I know it's, it was just tough for me to even get things going and I'm in

[00:44:39] the city every day.

[00:44:40] Right.

[00:44:40] So, but with your job being gone for long time, long periods and then back and gone

[00:44:47] again, I want to kind of get in like how, how, what was, what were the hardest challenge,

[00:44:53] biggest challenges in a relationship just first when it was just you and your wife or

[00:44:58] girlfriend?

[00:44:59] And then, you know, how did it get into turning into a family?

[00:45:03] And, and.

[00:45:03] Sorry, I've been saying wife.

[00:45:04] Is it your wife?

[00:45:05] Technically.

[00:45:06] Partner.

[00:45:06] Yeah.

[00:45:06] Whatever.

[00:45:07] Okay.

[00:45:07] Okay.

[00:45:10] I've been engaged for 10 years.

[00:45:11] Okay.

[00:45:11] Yeah.

[00:45:11] You live together.

[00:45:12] It doesn't matter.

[00:45:12] You're screwed anyway.

[00:45:13] Yeah.

[00:45:14] But yeah, no.

[00:45:15] So.

[00:45:15] We have two contracts.

[00:45:17] Yeah.

[00:45:17] Eight and five.

[00:45:18] Yeah.

[00:45:19] Yeah, exactly.

[00:45:20] But yeah.

[00:45:20] So what are, yeah.

[00:45:21] What were the, the, the, the challenges, which things maybe were easier?

[00:45:26] Tell us a little bit about that.

[00:45:28] Ooh.

[00:45:29] Dating, you know.

[00:45:30] Yeah.

[00:45:30] Yeah.

[00:45:30] Yeah.

[00:45:30] I mean, for the longest time, I, I just stayed single touring.

[00:45:36] Um, I had seen, you know, I like to think of myself as a careful operator, but that's

[00:45:45] only in some things.

[00:45:46] It's, I'm, I'm, I'm reckless in other areas, but, but just kind of observing other musicians,

[00:45:52] you know, touring musicians, you know, kind of settle down with somebody that wasn't from

[00:45:57] their hometown or country or somewhere.

[00:46:00] Like I, we've lost half of our band to Australia, you know, in the past, like, you know, lots of

[00:46:05] relationships with Australians.

[00:46:07] Um, there, there's a bit of a, um, I mean, I always thought that that's a, that's a big

[00:46:14] factor to consider, you know, like this is great now.

[00:46:18] Like let's live here for two years.

[00:46:20] Let's, but let's fast forward, you know, 20, 30 years.

[00:46:23] Then what, you know, bring kids into that.

[00:46:26] Where do we want?

[00:46:27] How, you know?

[00:46:28] Yeah.

[00:46:28] So yeah, that, that kind of like spooked me a little.

[00:46:30] So I just, just kind of like, and in my head, back of my head, I was always thinking

[00:46:34] once I hit 40, then I'm going to get a little more serious about maybe finding someone.

[00:46:40] Yeah.

[00:46:40] And I was always truly 50, 50 about kids.

[00:46:43] Like if it happens, great.

[00:46:45] If it doesn't happen, great.

[00:46:47] Yeah.

[00:46:47] Like it was, I didn't need it.

[00:46:49] I didn't also, you know, avoid, like, like not, not want to be able to be able to be able

[00:46:53] against it by any means.

[00:46:54] No, not against it, not for it.

[00:46:56] Um, yeah.

[00:46:58] And then, uh, kind of fast forward to, you know, my current relationship, um, you know,

[00:47:03] just kind of happened, you know, it, it just kind of started organically.

[00:47:09] There was interest on both parts.

[00:47:10] It was someone that I've known, had known for like met over 10 years before that.

[00:47:16] Okay.

[00:47:17] But, you know, back then there wasn't, there was never any like romantic interest or anything.

[00:47:22] It was just like, we knew each other, you know, I think I might have it wrong, but I,

[00:47:26] I feel like we kind of knew each other just from being around the Albert, but also other

[00:47:29] shows or whatever.

[00:47:30] Yeah.

[00:47:31] But, uh, yeah.

[00:47:32] And then, um, I mean, I'm not going to throw her under the bus, but I think she wanted the

[00:47:38] relationship to progress a little faster than I did.

[00:47:40] Yeah.

[00:47:41] Cause I was still, you know, touring a lot and, you know, it was always a consideration of

[00:47:44] mine because I, I wanted that person to make sure, cause this is what I do.

[00:47:50] I'm not, I'm not stopping.

[00:47:52] Yeah.

[00:47:52] That's right.

[00:47:52] You know, this is, this is sort of like a non-negotiable thing.

[00:47:55] Cause this is, I, I'm one of those weirdos where I found, I found somewhere where I fit in

[00:48:01] or, or fit in.

[00:48:03] I felt like I belonged.

[00:48:05] Yeah.

[00:48:05] I felt like I could contribute, you know, this is my sort of thing.

[00:48:09] Um, so yeah, I just wanted to make sure that whoever I was going to be with understood

[00:48:16] that, um, fully knowing there, there will still always be challenges anyways.

[00:48:22] So we, we had started talking about like, you know, where we're gonna, you know, want

[00:48:28] to be and kids and all that.

[00:48:30] And, you know, that was definitely something that, you know, was fully on the table.

[00:48:36] Timeline wise, we weren't really sure when and all that and where, cause like, are we

[00:48:42] going to stay in Winnipeg or, you know, there were, there were ideas being floated.

[00:48:46] And then all of a sudden I'm on tour, played a show in Prague, driving overnight to Budapest

[00:48:54] and I get a call or I wake up cause I have to go to the bathroom or sharing a bus with

[00:48:58] Bane.

[00:48:59] So I'm in my bunk.

[00:49:00] I wake up cause I have to pee all the time and four missed calls.

[00:49:04] And I was like, Ooh, so go to the bathroom.

[00:49:07] I'm coming back.

[00:49:08] Like, all right, I should give her calls.

[00:49:10] I was going to call, she calls again.

[00:49:12] And then, uh, it's like, what's going on?

[00:49:14] She's like, I'm pregnant.

[00:49:16] Just right into it.

[00:49:17] Well, at least she was right out with it.

[00:49:19] Yeah.

[00:49:19] And, and yeah, just looking back, you know, just, I remember that moment.

[00:49:25] Like I was just like, all right, here we are.

[00:49:28] This is not what we planned, but it's fine.

[00:49:31] Yeah.

[00:49:32] Keep on driving, buddy.

[00:49:33] Keep on driving.

[00:49:34] Oh no.

[00:49:34] I finished that tour just like this.

[00:49:36] I confided in one person because, and I wouldn't have, but only because, you know, planning

[00:49:42] tours and stuff like that.

[00:49:44] You're not doing that, you know, just like in a couple of weeks, like we're talking like

[00:49:47] you're planning six a year.

[00:49:50] Yeah.

[00:49:50] Andrew, I got to tell you something.

[00:49:53] Yeah.

[00:49:54] Yeah.

[00:49:54] So.

[00:49:55] And if anyone, you and him have been the two.

[00:49:58] Like we are, we've always been, well, I shouldn't say always, but I mean, especially at that time.

[00:50:04] We were the decision makers.

[00:50:05] Yeah.

[00:50:06] But yeah, it, it, yeah.

[00:50:09] Like it was, it was, it was odd, but also kind of like, like awesome.

[00:50:13] It's just like, right.

[00:50:15] This is how it's going to be.

[00:50:16] Yeah.

[00:50:16] You know, like.

[00:50:18] Yeah.

[00:50:19] I can't put a pause on that.

[00:50:21] No, no, no.

[00:50:21] So that's going to happen.

[00:50:23] So did you find, like you had to book tours.

[00:50:29] This was happening.

[00:50:29] Yeah.

[00:50:30] You're, you're in it.

[00:50:31] Yeah.

[00:50:32] What were the, what were the great things about it and what were the challenges about

[00:50:36] it?

[00:50:37] Like, did you take some time off?

[00:50:38] Did you.

[00:50:39] Yeah.

[00:50:39] Yeah.

[00:50:40] We took, so yeah, my band was super cool about it both times.

[00:50:43] That's awesome.

[00:50:44] Both surprises.

[00:50:45] Um, yeah.

[00:50:46] Like took a little bit of time off before, like maybe a month.

[00:50:50] Yeah.

[00:50:51] Just to make sure that that was, you know, that's always a weird window that last.

[00:50:54] Well, I think with Jack, there might've been even more time.

[00:50:57] I remember Rosie, I was in South America like one month before and I was just.

[00:51:01] It was just uncomfortable.

[00:51:02] I couldn't wait to get home.

[00:51:03] Anything could happen, right?

[00:51:04] Like the baby could come.

[00:51:05] I was just dreading my phone call.

[00:51:06] Like, I think I'm in late.

[00:51:07] You know, I was just, I had this feeling like this is going to happen.

[00:51:10] I know it, but it didn't.

[00:51:12] That's good.

[00:51:12] Other terrible things happened.

[00:51:13] Like our van getting stolen at home.

[00:51:15] But anyway.

[00:51:16] Oh shit.

[00:51:19] But yeah, we took off between three and four months.

[00:51:24] Okay.

[00:51:24] With both kids.

[00:51:25] Okay.

[00:51:25] You know, and you know, tip of the hat to my band.

[00:51:29] Yeah.

[00:51:29] That's great.

[00:51:29] Like that's not something I can expect because they're not, they're not expecting a kid.

[00:51:33] It's not their kid.

[00:51:34] But everybody was cool with it.

[00:51:35] And, and honestly, like just to zoom out, like I think it was also healthy for the band

[00:51:39] because you know, we do go.

[00:51:41] Yeah.

[00:51:41] And so taking pauses like that, I wish we would do that without that excuse too.

[00:51:45] Yeah.

[00:51:46] Like where it's just like, can we just keep.

[00:51:48] We just need a break.

[00:51:49] A four month like block where we can just kind of look forward to doing something else

[00:51:53] with our lives for a bit.

[00:51:54] Cause we're guilty of kind of not doing that.

[00:51:56] Yeah.

[00:51:56] Say yes to more things than we should.

[00:51:58] Well, and then writing falls into that and you got to put out albums and I guess.

[00:52:02] And I would love those breaks without that, that burden as well.

[00:52:06] Yeah.

[00:52:06] Right.

[00:52:06] Like where it's just like.

[00:52:07] Cause I guess when you take a break now, it's like, well, we better record an album or we

[00:52:10] better get writing.

[00:52:11] There's no breaks.

[00:52:12] No, no, no.

[00:52:13] Mentally, there's no breaks.

[00:52:14] There's all, you're like, you're, it's always going to be on.

[00:52:17] Yeah.

[00:52:18] You're not nine to five in 40 hours a week.

[00:52:20] No, but you're business owners.

[00:52:22] Yeah.

[00:52:22] Like in like, that's how I equate it.

[00:52:24] Cause that's what I am now.

[00:52:26] And like, it's, you're a business owner.

[00:52:28] It's a hundred percent.

[00:52:28] You wake up with it.

[00:52:29] You go to bed with it.

[00:52:30] Like no matter what's going on or if you have a show or an album or whatever, you're in

[00:52:34] it every day of the week.

[00:52:36] A hundred percent.

[00:52:36] All the time.

[00:52:36] It's a labor of love.

[00:52:38] I'm happy to do it, but it, it's not relaxing.

[00:52:41] No, no, no, no.

[00:52:42] Especially when you're dealing with, um, you know, different time zones too, because like

[00:52:48] Europe's waking up when I'm asleep.

[00:52:50] So I'm waking up and there could very well be some time sensitive stuff that needs to get

[00:52:55] hammered out now, but I wasn't planning on because I got two kids to take, you know,

[00:52:58] like juggling that's definitely not every day, but, but you know, you, the fact that that

[00:53:04] can happen is just something you live with.

[00:53:06] Right.

[00:53:06] So you, you're, you're always kind of like at that.

[00:53:09] Yeah.

[00:53:09] Yeah.

[00:53:10] Well, you're at that level of readiness all the time because you're used to it.

[00:53:13] Yeah.

[00:53:13] And so it's just like, you know what?

[00:53:15] And at least now you've been doing it long enough that like, I'm sure the first time you

[00:53:19] went through all that stuff, it was probably a little more challenging than it is today.

[00:53:23] Oh, for sure.

[00:53:24] Yeah.

[00:53:24] Just like, just because you're used to it.

[00:53:26] You're like, Oh, I know this is what expects we're booking a tour.

[00:53:29] Yeah.

[00:53:29] I know this is what's involved in when we book tours and here's all the people we talked

[00:53:33] to and blah, blah, blah.

[00:53:34] Like at least now you've got, and I would assume you deal with a lot of the same people.

[00:53:39] Yeah.

[00:53:40] I mean, like in Europe we've had literally the same booking agents since our second tour

[00:53:45] and we've done a hundred.

[00:53:46] Oh, okay.

[00:53:46] That's awesome.

[00:53:47] That's great.

[00:53:48] So, you know, that's, that's, you know, gets a little more structured and processed.

[00:53:54] Kind of.

[00:53:54] Yeah.

[00:53:54] There's other wild cards, but top three.

[00:53:58] Yeah.

[00:53:59] But he's, yeah, yeah.

[00:54:00] It's, it's, it's a relationship that's, you know, easy.

[00:54:04] And so with your kids, with you being gone so frequently, like what's that, how's that

[00:54:10] been with them being so young and building relationships with them and being a dad and.

[00:54:16] Yeah.

[00:54:17] It, it, it's, it's a strange one because there's a lot of, I don't know if the, I don't

[00:54:24] know if guilt is the right word, but that feeling of just like, like when I'm gone, especially

[00:54:29] when there's some downtime.

[00:54:30] Cause that's, that's the whole thing about the road is it's hurry up and wait.

[00:54:33] Yeah.

[00:54:33] Like go, go, go.

[00:54:35] Cause you've got to be there at this time.

[00:54:36] But now that you're here and you did that thing that you had to do for whatever, maybe

[00:54:40] a sound check or whatever.

[00:54:42] Now you've got four to six hours and it's sometimes it's hard to be productive in that

[00:54:47] window.

[00:54:48] And being a dad, it's like, oh, like this is time that I wish I could like.

[00:54:54] If my kids were here, we could go do sightseeing or just whatever.

[00:54:58] Right.

[00:54:58] Yeah.

[00:54:58] Which I got to do with my kid.

[00:55:00] And yeah.

[00:55:00] Yeah.

[00:55:00] So.

[00:55:01] Yeah.

[00:55:02] I guess it doesn't come to later though.

[00:55:03] Yeah.

[00:55:04] And, and so those are the moments that I, that I cherish is when, when I can kind of

[00:55:09] make them part of that unique experience that I know most people aren't going to be able

[00:55:14] to experience it.

[00:55:15] This is one thing I can offer you.

[00:55:16] I know this sucks, but that, you know, I'm trying to find silver linings, you know, with

[00:55:21] what I do.

[00:55:22] Cause this, it is what I do, you know?

[00:55:24] So it's.

[00:55:25] Well, yeah.

[00:55:26] And that's like that you're not getting a desk job.

[00:55:28] Like I can't.

[00:55:29] No, I think you're well.

[00:55:31] I am, I am that weird, like square peg that can't fit in certain round holes.

[00:55:37] When you retire from music, will we see you at home Depot?

[00:55:40] Yeah.

[00:55:40] I mean, it was funny.

[00:55:42] Like, like I had this conversation with other aging.

[00:55:46] Or it's just like, are we ready to put that orange apron on yet or not?

[00:55:49] Because, you know, we need to figure something out because it's like I'm 50 and less than,

[00:55:55] well, yeah, I just crossed the 18 month.

[00:55:57] Okay.

[00:55:57] I do this weird countdown thing.

[00:55:59] So yeah, I'm getting, closing in on 50, but.

[00:56:01] Now you talked about other projects.

[00:56:03] Yeah.

[00:56:03] Earlier you talked about having some other things in your mind that you wanted to get

[00:56:07] out in.

[00:56:07] Have you done other projects or.

[00:56:09] Not properly.

[00:56:10] Or would you like to, like, do you have stuff that's kind of sitting and waiting for that

[00:56:14] moment where it's like, oh, I'm going to do this afterwards.

[00:56:16] Like.

[00:56:17] I'd like to do it now.

[00:56:18] Okay.

[00:56:19] Yeah.

[00:56:19] Yeah.

[00:56:19] No, I have, I have a variety of things I'd love to do, but time and money are, you know,

[00:56:27] factors.

[00:56:27] Cause like I, I, I have the ideas.

[00:56:29] Um, I'd love to see them through properly, but.

[00:56:34] You know, someday when I have a proper recording studios, like set up.

[00:56:39] Yeah.

[00:56:39] I'm also, you know, pretty like, um, individualistic about a lot of that.

[00:56:45] So collaborating with other people that would probably help move a project along, but I'm

[00:56:51] also kind of wanting to be a bit of a control freak with, with some of these ideas where it's,

[00:56:56] you know, just my past experiences of, you know, bringing ideas and then getting changed

[00:57:01] to where it's like, I get less stoked on things.

[00:57:03] Um, there's certain things I just want to see through and when, I don't know.

[00:57:08] I don't know.

[00:57:08] I'd like to, I don't know.

[00:57:10] I'm, I'm always like recording on my phone and like I have albums that, that, that are

[00:57:19] just need a little extra refining and basically need someone to say, Hey, I have $10,000 for

[00:57:24] recording budget.

[00:57:24] All right, we can do it.

[00:57:25] Yeah.

[00:57:26] Nice.

[00:57:27] But yeah, let's take a break and then we'll be back.

[00:57:29] Hey, Tommy, among all the episodes we've recorded, you know, there's one common theme and that's

[00:57:35] getting therapy.

[00:57:37] We've talked about it lots.

[00:57:39] Many, many times.

[00:57:40] You had a really tough time making that first phone call.

[00:57:43] I had a tough time making that first phone call.

[00:57:45] I didn't even know if the person I was going to see was the right person, but you got to

[00:57:49] just try.

[00:57:51] Thank goodness.

[00:57:52] We have a sponsor that makes it way easier now.

[00:57:55] BetterHelp has an online platform that allows you to fill out a questionnaire.

[00:57:59] They connect you with a therapist and you get to communicate with them however you want.

[00:58:04] And it makes it way less scary to be connected with someone.

[00:58:07] And if you're not into the person you talk to, they'll sign you another one right away.

[00:58:12] I've gotten to sign mine already and I can't wait to use it.

[00:58:15] Like by the time you hear this, I will have had my first session and I'm super pumped to

[00:58:20] talk about it on the show.

[00:58:21] Yeah, I'm very excited about it and it's very easy to sign up.

[00:58:24] It took us maybe five minutes to sign up and you answer just simple questions.

[00:58:30] And next thing you know, you got a message that you will be paired up with a therapist.

[00:58:35] And within the same day, we got the therapist already and the name and a message from them

[00:58:41] and we were able to communicate with them.

[00:58:42] So it's extremely easy.

[00:58:44] So please go to betterhelp.com.

[00:58:47] Yeah, that's the thing.

[00:58:48] Betterhelp.com slash quietriotshow.

[00:58:52] And you get to also enjoy a 10% off for your first month if you sign up using this link.

[00:58:58] So again, right here, I'm going to be doing it from here.

[00:59:02] Yeah, it's betterhelp.com slash quietriotshow.

[00:59:09] So yeah, sign up today and you're not going to regret it because I'm already enjoying it.

[00:59:15] Just the fact that we connected with therapists.

[00:59:17] Me too, man.

[00:59:18] Thank you to BetterHelp for supporting this podcast.

[00:59:21] Actually, that's a funny thing I wanted to talk to you about.

[00:59:24] You being an introvert and sort of having that side of you, so much of your time touring,

[00:59:31] you don't really necessarily get to be that.

[00:59:35] But like the recording, writing.

[00:59:36] No, I do.

[00:59:37] I go for long walks.

[00:59:38] Oh, okay.

[00:59:39] Well, I guess those four or five hour breaks in between.

[00:59:44] Talk to me or talk to everybody a little bit about like the writing recording process

[00:59:49] versus the touring playing process.

[00:59:52] What do you love about both?

[00:59:53] What are some things that maybe you don't love about both or what are challenges in both

[00:59:57] of those for you?

[01:00:02] I love aspects of the writing process.

[01:00:04] I absolutely love aspects of the writing process.

[01:00:09] There's just something fun.

[01:00:11] Like when you're in the zone, oh, that's the best.

[01:00:16] Like when I look back on my contributions to our albums, not all of them, but there are

[01:00:24] certain ones where I remember like building those parts.

[01:00:28] And when they actually, you get to see that come out the way that you had kind of initially

[01:00:37] vibed off of it.

[01:00:38] That's the reward as far as, you know, the creative component of it goes.

[01:00:45] There's other less exciting parts about that.

[01:00:47] And like I said, I am introverted.

[01:00:50] And, you know, when it comes to collabing with people, I have a little bit of difficulty

[01:00:54] with that, but so much of being in a band is that.

[01:00:59] So I have a lot of self-induced anxiety when it comes to, you know, writing.

[01:01:05] Is this going to be good enough?

[01:01:07] How do I tell that person that I'm not feeling that, that they're, that I know they really,

[01:01:11] they really, yeah.

[01:01:12] You know, it's, those are difficult.

[01:01:14] Those are, those are conversations I stress about and find so difficult and maybe, and

[01:01:19] I over, I know I overthink it.

[01:01:21] You know, I'm not putting it on anybody else but me.

[01:01:24] Well, and you have to give it.

[01:01:25] Yeah.

[01:01:25] And you have to receive it too.

[01:01:27] Totally.

[01:01:27] And so I guess that's its own enemy.

[01:01:29] Oh, and it's really hard sometimes.

[01:01:31] Like when you, when you're, and I know what I'm doing to somebody else, you know, cause

[01:01:35] I know how that feels because.

[01:01:36] For you, yeah.

[01:01:37] Sometimes you just have a riff, but there's like more going on that you can't always

[01:01:42] convey.

[01:01:43] And when you can't convey that, I can't expect them to see it.

[01:01:50] And they're, they're, they're going to be like, I'm not feeling that.

[01:01:52] And it's like, I know why you're not feeling that.

[01:01:54] Cause you don't get what I'm.

[01:01:55] But we're not, you know.

[01:01:56] We're not there yet.

[01:01:56] It's funny because through all of that, like all, all seven records, I've come to a point

[01:02:03] with Andrew, for those who don't know, he's former guitar player, now vocalist.

[01:02:09] Me and him are the, the two mainstays in the band.

[01:02:12] Anyways, he's someone that I've kind of come to trust with his vision.

[01:02:18] Cause so many times he's got, I have no problem saying this.

[01:02:22] He's got a weird ass brain.

[01:02:24] Yes.

[01:02:25] And when it comes to certain aspects of that writing process, there, there are times where

[01:02:34] I have just like gone back and been like, I trust him.

[01:02:38] Yeah.

[01:02:38] I don't see it right now, but I try.

[01:02:40] I used to fight him on it.

[01:02:41] Like on certain, certain, certain parts, like in earlier records, like where I just didn't

[01:02:45] get what he, like this, nothing's making sense here.

[01:02:49] Yeah.

[01:02:49] But there's, there's now just being in a band with him for so long, the last couple of records,

[01:02:54] it's like when he's, when I can see that hamster wheel moving in his brain.

[01:02:59] Just let him go.

[01:03:00] And I, but if, but if I just was to record that and play it back for somebody else, yeah,

[01:03:06] the, I, I, I can't always see the vision, but I can see, you know, off, off.

[01:03:14] Yeah.

[01:03:14] I'm, I'm vibing off of him vibing.

[01:03:16] Yeah.

[01:03:16] Well, and you've had like you, the two of you have had so many years together.

[01:03:21] Yeah.

[01:03:21] Creating and performing.

[01:03:23] Totally.

[01:03:23] I guess we haven't gotten to the performing part yet, but creating like you guys have

[01:03:27] been creating music together for fucking so long.

[01:03:30] Yeah.

[01:03:30] So like at a certain point you get to, like you said, Andrew has a weird ass brain.

[01:03:36] I know Andrew just a speck of what you do and like, yes, he does, but he's phenomenal

[01:03:41] at how that brain works is amazing.

[01:03:44] And like does incredible things.

[01:03:47] Yeah.

[01:03:47] Like just, and I guess you just get to know that and learn that.

[01:03:52] So you evolved as a band, right?

[01:03:54] And as a musician yourself too.

[01:03:55] Totally.

[01:03:56] Like, I mean, if you look at our first record, it's very simplistic, but there was also visions

[01:03:59] there.

[01:04:01] But now like, you know, everything gets a little more complex than Laird and I'm, I'm probably

[01:04:07] guilty of being the really conservative one in the band with the like, ah, you know, let's

[01:04:11] try to stick within the parameters and not go too far out.

[01:04:15] But just like his, he's a, he, his songwriting is good, but his arrangements, like the way

[01:04:24] he can like arrange a song is, I think I'd go so far to say is he's one of the best out

[01:04:33] there.

[01:04:33] Like he can take, like if you give him, you know, intro, verse, chorus, verse, chorus,

[01:04:40] pre whatever breakdown or the, you know, whatever the payoff.

[01:04:44] And then we come back here, just give him some time with that.

[01:04:47] And if he's feeling that he's going to turn it around and then send it back to you.

[01:04:52] And you're going to be like, I don't know.

[01:04:54] Then he puts vocals over it.

[01:04:56] And you're this like, holy shit.

[01:04:58] Oh fuck.

[01:04:59] There it is.

[01:04:59] Yeah.

[01:05:00] Yeah.

[01:05:00] That's exactly what we want.

[01:05:02] Yeah.

[01:05:02] The math isn't working here, but anyways, that's, you know, and it's, it's been interesting

[01:05:07] kind of being like a fly on the wall sometimes, but anyways, go back to writing.

[01:05:12] Love most of it.

[01:05:13] I have a tough time with the cloud.

[01:05:15] I'm not against collaborating, but I have a lot of self-induced anxiety that I, it's

[01:05:20] just an ongoing work in progress.

[01:05:22] And that's always been like, I hate it, but it's always there.

[01:05:25] And then it gets worse when we get into the studio.

[01:05:28] I do not like recording.

[01:05:30] I love the idea of it, but I don't like being in the studio.

[01:05:32] Okay.

[01:05:34] I just, I just like, I'm not a great guitar player.

[01:05:36] I'm average at best.

[01:05:38] Okay.

[01:05:38] And there are times, no, for real.

[01:05:41] Like I'm not a, I'm not a shredder.

[01:05:42] Everybody knows.

[01:05:43] Yeah.

[01:05:43] I'm a bar chord.

[01:05:45] Yeah.

[01:05:45] Octaves.

[01:05:46] You know, I can, I can, I can paint the picture a bit, but I'm not like a flashy

[01:05:51] shredder at all.

[01:05:53] Yeah.

[01:05:53] So, but there's certain times where you're recording and you're like, it's a two or three

[01:05:57] second part, but I have done 50 takes and I don't know what I need to do to step outside

[01:06:02] to get back in to like nail this.

[01:06:05] Anyways, I, I always feel like that being under the microscope, like I feel it twice as much

[01:06:11] as I should.

[01:06:11] Again, self-induced anxiety.

[01:06:13] Not a big fan.

[01:06:14] But I think, I mean, and I know there are probably like freak musicians that will, you

[01:06:20] know, grab the instrument and nail it on one take, you know.

[01:06:22] Oh yeah.

[01:06:23] But I think most people are very harsh on themselves.

[01:06:29] Yeah.

[01:06:29] Right.

[01:06:29] Cause like you, you'll record a part and everyone will tell you, oh, this is great.

[01:06:33] And you'll be like, no, no, no.

[01:06:36] I want to redo it.

[01:06:37] Yeah.

[01:06:37] And I want to redo it again.

[01:06:38] And again.

[01:06:39] And again.

[01:06:39] That's what your producer's for.

[01:06:41] Yeah.

[01:06:42] For sure.

[01:06:42] Totally.

[01:06:43] And sometimes it's even the opposite where I'm like, it's good enough.

[01:06:45] And they're like, no, it's not.

[01:06:46] Yeah.

[01:06:47] Yeah.

[01:06:50] Nine times out of 10, I still will say I'm right because just the way that you can record

[01:06:55] and layer things, you can get it.

[01:06:57] But at the end of the day, you just want to work.

[01:06:59] Like, I mean, I would love to do like all of my recording in one take, you know, just

[01:07:03] like, you know, the, the two and a half minute song.

[01:07:06] Just do it.

[01:07:07] Yeah.

[01:07:07] You know, no cut.

[01:07:08] But I mean, it looks like, like, like, like when we were recording Wake the Dead, guys,

[01:07:13] like, it looks like a fucking barcode.

[01:07:14] Like, you know, you just got all these edits.

[01:07:16] It just does.

[01:07:17] That's just.

[01:07:17] Well, and I've like, I've only done a couple albums, but like, I've worked with both types

[01:07:21] of people, like producers where it's like one wants more of the natural feel.

[01:07:25] So you go longer, you do longer takes.

[01:07:27] And then the other guy wants like, no, I just need that word or that phrase.

[01:07:31] And it's like, that feels fucking weird.

[01:07:32] And like, they have a way of getting you to do it.

[01:07:35] So it doesn't feel weird.

[01:07:36] But like, it's weird.

[01:07:37] Yeah.

[01:07:37] You look at it and it's just like, holy fuck.

[01:07:39] Did I even do this?

[01:07:41] Just give me a note.

[01:07:42] Okay.

[01:07:42] Okay.

[01:07:43] That's all I do.

[01:07:45] But no, I like, but there's also a part of, you know, being in the studio that I do love,

[01:07:50] especially when it comes to, you know, getting layering things.

[01:07:55] And that gets fun.

[01:07:55] And, you know, like we're not.

[01:07:57] Painting the picture.

[01:07:57] Like, really like adding layers to it, adding colors to it.

[01:08:01] And like.

[01:08:01] Exactly.

[01:08:02] And getting creative.

[01:08:03] And Andrew's vocals.

[01:08:04] Yeah.

[01:08:04] Like, nine times out of 10, you know, we've gone into the studio with the music, but the

[01:08:10] lyrics aren't ready.

[01:08:11] So it's, it's kind of like a little, you know, you don't feel fully confident going

[01:08:17] in because it's like, I don't know where we're at.

[01:08:19] It's a little dry.

[01:08:20] Yeah.

[01:08:20] But then again, it's just like, you know, I got that faith in the kid and that kid, you

[01:08:24] know, or it's like, guy knows what he's doing.

[01:08:26] Yeah.

[01:08:27] You know, like, I don't like, he gets kind of bummed at us because we don't go like, like,

[01:08:32] for example, this last record that we did, the last full length we did, Heavy Steps.

[01:08:36] We recorded with John Paul and we started to realize that we had, it was during COVID.

[01:08:41] So we had too many songs and we're just like, we're going to run out of time.

[01:08:46] So we ended up using the second studio and getting somebody else, this guy Benjamin, to

[01:08:51] track his vocals.

[01:08:53] Oh, okay.

[01:08:53] Yeah.

[01:08:54] And, you know, the reason that John Paul kept on doing that was because we know Andrew knows

[01:08:59] what he's doing.

[01:08:59] He's produced records.

[01:09:00] He knows.

[01:09:00] Yeah.

[01:09:00] He knows what he wants.

[01:09:01] He's going to tell you anyways, what he's going to do.

[01:09:04] You're not going to tell him like, do it this way.

[01:09:06] He's got his way that he's going to track his vocals, but he gets kind of bummed because

[01:09:09] we're not in the room, but it's like, I kind of want to just stay out of there.

[01:09:12] Like if you need me and you want to bounce something off me, I'm happy to be here.

[01:09:15] Yeah.

[01:09:16] But it's like, I'm, I'm, I'm kind of more focused on the guitar tracking and stuff like

[01:09:20] that.

[01:09:21] I have full confidence that he's going to like, yeah, maybe there's the odd thing to be

[01:09:24] like, uh, I'm not feeling that.

[01:09:25] But like.

[01:09:27] That Heavy Steps video is fucking hilarious, by the way.

[01:09:29] It's so good.

[01:09:30] The B-Day part.

[01:09:31] Anyone listening, if you haven't watched it, watch it.

[01:09:33] Yeah, do it.

[01:09:34] Okay.

[01:09:35] So that's recording.

[01:09:36] Yep.

[01:09:36] Now talk to me about performing.

[01:09:38] Oh, yeah.

[01:09:39] Uh, sorry.

[01:09:40] What exactly do you want to know?

[01:09:41] Just, uh, what are, what are your favorite parts of it?

[01:09:44] What are the struggles you have with it?

[01:09:46] What?

[01:09:46] Touring or performing?

[01:09:47] No, performing.

[01:09:48] Performing.

[01:09:48] Um, I think we covered a bunch of touring stuff.

[01:09:50] Yeah.

[01:09:51] Kind of, but we didn't talk about actually on stage.

[01:09:54] I love playing.

[01:09:55] I love, I love like, yeah, my, my, my, my, my, my favorite moments will always be the

[01:10:01] three to 500 cap rooms that are stuffed.

[01:10:03] You know, just like no barricade.

[01:10:06] Let's go.

[01:10:06] Yeah.

[01:10:07] Oh yeah.

[01:10:07] You got, you got, do you guys ever have a barricade?

[01:10:09] Yeah.

[01:10:10] Yeah.

[01:10:10] But not, not that we, we never ask for a barricade.

[01:10:12] In fact, we ask for it to be, it, can it be removed?

[01:10:15] Yeah.

[01:10:15] You know, and we're supporting, obviously it is what it is.

[01:10:18] Um, you know, it's the headliners call or the venues call.

[01:10:21] Yeah.

[01:10:21] But if we have the call, there will never be a barricade there.

[01:10:24] I don't think you guys had a barricade in Winnipeg.

[01:10:26] No, I don't think.

[01:10:28] Well.

[01:10:28] I think that would be rude to the Winnipeg fans.

[01:10:30] Yeah.

[01:10:30] Like on some of the bigger supporters.

[01:10:33] Sometimes I'm sure you don't have a choice, but.

[01:10:34] Yeah.

[01:10:34] Like for example, like last year we played the Burt Block Party or when we opened for

[01:10:38] Bad Religion Dropkick at the arena.

[01:10:40] Yeah.

[01:10:40] That's going to, you know, those shows, it's non-negotiable.

[01:10:43] Yeah.

[01:10:43] But, um, yeah, when we're playing the park or back in the day collective or wherever you've

[01:10:47] seen us.

[01:10:48] Oh, the collective.

[01:10:49] Yeah.

[01:10:49] There's, there's not going to be a barricade unless, unless it's being imposed.

[01:10:54] Yeah.

[01:10:54] Yeah.

[01:10:54] On us.

[01:10:55] But no, I, I like, that's, that's what we live for that 45 minutes or hour or whatever.

[01:10:59] It's like.

[01:11:00] Yeah.

[01:11:00] That is the, that's the joy in the whole.

[01:11:03] Yeah.

[01:11:03] Yeah.

[01:11:04] The culmination of all the hard work and the things.

[01:11:06] That's what makes it worth it.

[01:11:07] Exactly.

[01:11:07] I'm getting my day out and I'm hoping, you know, cause I know there's kids in there

[01:11:11] that they've been waiting.

[01:11:12] Yeah.

[01:11:13] I wanted to talk to you about, or ask you basically, what, what does, what does that feel like

[01:11:19] to, um, when you, when you get asked, you know, by a little kid, like, Hey, can we,

[01:11:24] can I take a photo with you or anything?

[01:11:27] Cause like, I've, I see, I've seen it on a receiving end from, you know, my, my son,

[01:11:32] but like, I understand you guys just finished playing a set.

[01:11:36] You're exhausted from whether touring or just playing the show.

[01:11:40] Right.

[01:11:40] And you probably just, once you're done, you just want to go sit down and, you know,

[01:11:44] relax and kind of recharge your batteries.

[01:11:47] But you know that there are those fans out there, maybe with kids that they'd really

[01:11:52] want to, you know, they're huge fans and they just want to take a picture.

[01:11:54] And is that something that like you guys love doing or.

[01:11:59] Yeah.

[01:11:59] I'll, I'll answer that very honestly.

[01:12:01] I love doing that.

[01:12:03] Um, I don't like having long conversations after I play.

[01:12:07] Yeah.

[01:12:07] But you know, if it's, if it's just like, you know, a thank you and da, da, da, da, da,

[01:12:13] you know, but if they want to start talking to me about my guitar tone on the last record

[01:12:17] and stuff like that, it's like, I don't know.

[01:12:21] I, not that I don't have time for you.

[01:12:23] It's not like, I'm trying to be rude, but it's, you know, you just got off the stage.

[01:12:26] Your brain's kind of a little, you've just been working.

[01:12:28] Well, you just left it all up there.

[01:12:30] Yeah.

[01:12:30] Like it's just like, but I will always, as long as I don't actually have to be on my way

[01:12:35] to the airport or something like that.

[01:12:36] Like whoever wants a picture or like, if you want me to sign the poster, like, yeah.

[01:12:43] We'll always.

[01:12:43] Yeah.

[01:12:43] No.

[01:12:43] And that's like, so my son got pictures with Dayseeker and this was like when they were playing

[01:12:49] here in Winnipeg with Silverstein.

[01:12:51] And then on Sunday we got pictures with Kingdom of Giants.

[01:12:55] And yeah, I just like, I always approach like, I know you guys are busy.

[01:13:00] I just want a photo, you know, and then I'm out of your way.

[01:13:03] Yeah.

[01:13:03] And usually like that, that was always well received and just.

[01:13:07] Well, I think we've always, we've all been that kid.

[01:13:10] Yeah.

[01:13:10] Yeah.

[01:13:11] Yeah.

[01:13:11] I mean, I still am sometimes.

[01:13:13] And when someone took a minute, like, I don't know if you think about that or have

[01:13:15] thought about that over the years.

[01:13:16] Oh, yeah.

[01:13:16] Like when someone took a minute.

[01:13:17] Can I tell a story and throw somebody under the bus?

[01:13:19] Oh, absolutely.

[01:13:19] Oh, yeah.

[01:13:19] Please.

[01:13:20] Okay.

[01:13:20] Okay.

[01:13:21] I, I was so bummed.

[01:13:24] Okay.

[01:13:24] This is this year.

[01:13:27] And so I'm, I'm traveling with my son, you know, we're, we're starting the European tour

[01:13:33] and it, and it's in, in Romania.

[01:13:35] Like we're traveling.

[01:13:37] So I, we landed Bucharest and, you know, on our way to go to through passport control to

[01:13:43] get in, into the EU or whatever.

[01:13:46] And we're walking down one of those conveyor belt thing, like not an escalator, but you

[01:13:50] know, and I'd see this guy pulling this like gator case.

[01:13:55] So I'm like, oh, that's, you know, pedal board as I'm passing.

[01:13:58] I'm, I'm like, Hey, are you guys playing the fest too?

[01:14:00] Cause we're playing this big festival.

[01:14:02] It's like creator hate breed, whatever.

[01:14:03] And in the mountains of Transylvania.

[01:14:06] Yeah.

[01:14:07] And then as soon as, as I'm talking, I'm like, Holy shit, that's Herman Lee from dragon

[01:14:10] force.

[01:14:11] Oh, fuck.

[01:14:12] And my son going kind of back to what I think you were saying maybe 20, 30 minutes

[01:14:18] ago in this conversation about your daughter, like, you know, kind of reckoning all that.

[01:14:22] Yeah.

[01:14:22] My son knows who dragon force.

[01:14:24] He doesn't know anybody else is, but he plays a game called brawl stars.

[01:14:28] I don't play games, but there's a game called brawl stars and there was some collab with

[01:14:32] dragon force.

[01:14:33] So he showed me one time and I was like, Oh, I know who that band is, you know?

[01:14:37] Anyways.

[01:14:37] So I go to her and like, can we get a pick?

[01:14:40] And he goes, do we really have to do that right now?

[01:14:44] What?

[01:14:45] I was just like, Oh, that's the, Oh, I was just like, I felt like a kid who just like

[01:14:49] got, Oh yeah.

[01:14:50] Your heart got crushed.

[01:14:52] Are you fucking kidding me?

[01:14:53] Like it's not for me.

[01:14:55] And the part that really bummed me out is because like, I'm not like a massive dragon

[01:14:59] force fan, but I've seen them a few times and they, you know, kind of play that epic,

[01:15:02] you know, metal, but their whole shtick is like fun.

[01:15:06] And like, and I was like, really?

[01:15:08] You don't have time for your fans like that at an air, like you're doing nothing.

[01:15:12] Like I get it.

[01:15:13] If you're like, but you're standing, walk into a gate like, and it's like, I don't

[01:15:18] know.

[01:15:18] I know.

[01:15:18] I understand.

[01:15:19] He's in a band that's way bigger than my band, but my philosophy has always been you,

[01:15:23] you, you always say yes.

[01:15:25] Yeah.

[01:15:25] Unless you actually have to be somewhere.

[01:15:28] Yeah.

[01:15:30] It was weird.

[01:15:31] It was kind of a bummer.

[01:15:32] Yeah.

[01:15:32] That's for sure.

[01:15:33] And I get some people want their personal space or whatever.

[01:15:36] Is he having a shit day?

[01:15:36] But I think, but I think you give up some of that when it's like you're a recognizable

[01:15:40] person.

[01:15:41] Yeah.

[01:15:41] Because, because they are, I look like if you want to look at it from a purely transactional

[01:15:46] view, the only reason I'm able to be here and pay for my mortgage is because of you.

[01:15:52] Why wouldn't I take a picture with you?

[01:15:54] There's two rules you don't break.

[01:15:56] That's like, you don't interrupt a celebrity.

[01:15:57] I know I'm not a celebrity, sorry, but you don't interrupt somebody when they're eating.

[01:16:02] Like you don't walk over, oh, look, there's a, whatever.

[01:16:05] No, that's fair.

[01:16:06] Yeah.

[01:16:06] There's Mark Shifley.

[01:16:08] He's eating at Montana's.

[01:16:09] Let's go ask him for a pick.

[01:16:10] You don't ask.

[01:16:11] No.

[01:16:11] And you, and you, well, this is more of a 50-50 one, but depending on their level of how

[01:16:21] involved they are with their kids, maybe, you know, like if somebody is like doing something

[01:16:26] with their kids, maybe don't.

[01:16:27] Yeah.

[01:16:28] Yeah.

[01:16:28] Like, I think those are two pretty good.

[01:16:30] Like if I'm out with my kid and somebody wants to picture that, it doesn't bother me at all.

[01:16:33] But I, but, but if I see like, you know, so-and-so out with their kid, you know, maybe don't

[01:16:38] go ask.

[01:16:38] I think that's a fair couple of rules.

[01:16:40] Yeah.

[01:16:41] That's reasonable.

[01:16:41] That is reasonable.

[01:16:42] But if you, if you have nothing but time, I don't give a fuck who you are.

[01:16:46] Yeah.

[01:16:46] Yeah.

[01:16:46] A-list, B-list, whatever.

[01:16:48] If you have a minute, respect your fans.

[01:16:50] Do we really have to do this?

[01:16:52] And I'm not, yeah.

[01:16:53] Are you fucking kidding?

[01:16:53] And I'm not just saying that because I got burnt, but that's my attitude towards it.

[01:16:56] It's like, you are the reason I'm able to do what I'm doing.

[01:17:00] Yeah.

[01:17:01] I, I have like to give you five or 10 seconds of my time for a picture or a signature.

[01:17:06] Absolutely.

[01:17:06] If you want a half hour conversation punishing me about my career, that's maybe a little

[01:17:11] bit different.

[01:17:12] Yeah.

[01:17:13] But yeah.

[01:17:13] Anyways, there's my rant for the day.

[01:17:16] I think, uh, I think that's a great way to close it out.

[01:17:19] I think so.

[01:17:19] Yeah.

[01:17:20] Absolutely.

[01:17:21] Just a surly rant.

[01:17:22] Yeah.

[01:17:22] We'll make sure we'll tag him.

[01:17:24] Yeah.

[01:17:26] We'll tag Herman Lee.

[01:17:26] If you want to take that pic next time you're with us, we can do it.

[01:17:29] I'll harbor no ill feelings.

[01:17:30] Jeremy, thank you so much for being here.

[01:17:32] Uh, it's nice to see you again.

[01:17:34] I haven't seen you in a long time and, uh, I do appreciate seeing you and that we've sort

[01:17:39] of always just been friendly with each other for a lot of years.

[01:17:42] And, um, thanks for taking time to be here and sit with us and, uh, you should get home

[01:17:46] and tuck your kid in.

[01:17:47] Well, happy to do it with you guys.

[01:17:49] So, uh, I know you drink coffee or tea, so, uh, that's a little thank you from us, uh,

[01:17:54] for you.

[01:17:55] Put the, put the, put the filter in my, uh, arrow.

[01:17:57] Oh, it's ready.

[01:17:58] Yeah.

[01:17:58] It's ready.

[01:17:59] Actually, you know, I'll give you more stickers.

[01:18:01] You can put it on your gear or whatever, you know, and, uh, and I've got two kids.

[01:18:05] There you go.

[01:18:06] Yeah.

[01:18:07] Um, thank you very much again.

[01:18:10] Yeah.

[01:18:10] You pretty much covered all, um, I wanted to say, but yeah, just for everyone else, uh,

[01:18:16] can our viewers follow you on your social media and your band?

[01:18:21] Do you want to just give it a little plug?

[01:18:23] Well, what is it again?

[01:18:25] I think it's Jeremy Heber 204 on Instagram.

[01:18:27] I think so.

[01:18:28] Yeah.

[01:18:29] Comeback kid.

[01:18:30] Like Instagram's kind of like, you know, we're in our forties, you know, we're not TikTok,

[01:18:34] but we're not MySpace.

[01:18:35] You guys aren't doing the dances?

[01:18:38] We should.

[01:18:39] I know we're missing out.

[01:18:40] Actually, you guys probably should do it just for shit-sake needles.

[01:18:42] We should put that effort in to learn a new platform.

[01:18:45] Oh, please don't.

[01:18:47] But yeah, the Comeback Kid one, I think is probably like Comeback Kid HC.

[01:18:50] I think so.

[01:18:50] Yeah.

[01:18:51] Something like that.

[01:18:51] Yeah.

[01:18:52] If you go to Comeback Kid, you'll find it on Instagram.

[01:18:54] Uh, follow us on Instagram and Facebook and we are on TikTok as well.

[01:18:58] No, I'm not.

[01:19:00] And YouTube, uh, Quiet Ride Show and send us an email if you have a question or just want

[01:19:04] to comment on our show or anything, uh, it's quietriotshow at gmail.com.

[01:19:10] Thank you again.

[01:19:11] Cheers.

[01:19:11] Thanks, buddy.

[01:19:12] Thanks for having me.

[01:19:13] See ya.

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